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"We delude ourselves that we want to imbue our children with honesty; instead what we want is to imbue them with our particular form of dishonesty." - Sidney Harris
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"We delude ourselves that we want to imbue our children with honesty; instead what we want is to imbue them with our particular form of dishonesty." - Sidney Harris
&
"Nothing is a stronger influence on children, than the un-lived life of the parent." - Jung.
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... but this is why good parenting is so crucial. This includes not being neglectful, too punitive, or helicopter parenting; not allowing kids to make their own mistakes (trust them with some power to do right and possibly wrong) to learn from their own mistakes.
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It's more often self-hatred which is traced back to poor modeling or shaping by one's environment in many ways. It could come from bad behavior too, as in being a part of the wrong group of friends and peer pressure, however, if you are brought up in a decent enough environment, one's self esteem is higher and that brings with it a sense of control over your own mind to make better decisions. Even when per-pressured, eventually, a kind of remorse comes through it via the fact that you know you did something wrong and it will hurt others who care for you.
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I think they can both influence each other but I think it starts with self hatred leading to bad behavior which leads to more self hatred which leads to more bad behavior. I came to this conclusion by realizing that people who respect themselves and love themselves are typically happy and don't do things they know they will regret or know that its "bad". but once one does start self loathing and engaging in bad behavior its a vicious downward spiral towards more self hatred and worse behavior.
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I think they can both influence each other but I think it starts with self hatred leading to bad behavior which leads to more self hatred which leads to more bad behavior. I came to this conclusion by realizing that people who respect themselves and love themselves are typically happy and don't do things they know they will regret or know that its "bad". but once one does start self loathing and engaging in bad behavior its a vicious downward spiral towards more self hatred and worse behavior.
As for you wondering if its possible to break out of the cycle, yes it is. Although, in my experience, you must both stop doing the behavior and work on liking yourself. You can't just do one and not the other. I don't know the whole story or know what bad behavior specifically that you are refering to, but it usually helps to have some one experienced (i.e. a counselor, mentor, therapist, religious leader etc.) help you figure out what steps to take.
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I love the question Heavan, but why do you seek ? More interesting is the story that gave you the inspiration for this query.
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I love the question Heavan, but why do you seek ? More interesting is the story that gave you the inspiration for this query.
After reading some of the responses, each with their own validity, it's value you will ask for, may relate to your own experience, will it not?
Other wise, you are taking a class in Yoda-isms.....tell us more great Jedi !
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Not really a direct answer to the question being asked, but I believe that self loathing leads bad treatment of others. When you do not love and respect yourself it is hard to extend love and respect to others. However, loving your self too much can also lead to problems (*ahem Narcissus)
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I think they feed off of each other. Bad behavior can come from a lot of different intentions and seems like it leads to self-hatred over time no matter what whether the person knows it or not. And self-hatred manifests itself in a lot of different ways not just "bad" behavior.
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I think they feed off of each other. Bad behavior can come from a lot of different intentions and seems like it leads to self-hatred over time no matter what whether the person knows it or not. And self-hatred manifests itself in a lot of different ways not just "bad" behavior.
For me, I never really outwardly claimed hatred of myself so I think my "bad" behaviors stemmed from holding back and bottling up. I wasn't comfortable with expressing my dissatisfaction because I was trying not to be for other people and ended up losing a part of myself. It seems like I kind of lost the priveledge to complain because I wasn't doing so in a healthy manner to begin with so it ended up becoming a much bigger thing than it could have been. It was the transition from military to civilian lyfestyle. In the military everything is serious with a casual undertone, as a civilian everything is casual and I was taking everything too serious. I lost enjoyment in everything by drinking too much to be the veteran leader for everyone instead of being it for myself.
Or something like that.
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It's like bad behavior and self-hatred are two fat people 69'n.. It's ugly.
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It's like bad behavior and self-hatred are two fat people 69'n.. It's ugly.
There are ways to stop it, though.
Distractions are good. For the fat couple it may be food. They love it. So they stop and eat it, cycle broken.
If you love to sing, sing. If you love to draw, draw. If you love 69'n, then 69 it up!
If you haven't found the thing you love, then you are at the perfect time to start searching. For me, right now, that's my love, just searching.
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I think self hatred leads to bad behavior. See a child, for example, who feels one morning that he is not enough and he needs to do something bad to get words in his direction, will try something naughty and THEN its like a vicious cycle, at that point each time he misbehaves, he will think he is even more worthy of that hate that started for no reason. Like everything alive, the child grows and its difficult but possible to stop the cycle.
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Both can be witnessed.
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Both can be witnessed.
Self-hatred leading to bad behavior: I dont fit in so i'll betray myself and make bad decisions that will hobble myself in order to live a "desirable life" (however desirable is defined by you/where you are/who you're with).
Bad behavior leading to self-hatred: My long-standing friends and family have a terrible trait that hobbles us intellectually/spiritually so I'm going to keep up with this "desirable life" because it is all I know.
Getting out of it requires faith, but it does not have to be in a church if religion isn't your bag. It's understanding that you can exist outside of your old comfort zone and find a greater, more fulfilling existence outside of your bad behavior. Classic leap of faith, but you can call it "balls" or "confidence" or "blindly not giving a f-."
To escape both of these scenarios, you have to know more than the people allowing you to make these mistakes. Believe yourself. In both scenarios you are acting in a cycle defined by something not wholly you, but defined by a pain you've associated with yourself. I wouldn't call fixing it a "reinvention," because you're getting closer to your true self. You, undiluted and unshackled.
That being said, it's still incredibly difficult.
Cheers!
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I think both ways.
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I think both ways.
If you believe in God: God made you perfect, so you shouldn't test his abilities.
Atheism: Well, the media influences you everyday. So your judgement could be off.
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I think behavior is learned and more dangerously, taught. So it is possible to "reinvent" the way you think which reflects ones behavior.
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I think it's the parent's behaviour in the beginning, then a lot of influence from others, then there's the chicken egg thing going on for a while, but then when someone just STOPS for a second and looks back on their life, and realizes what's up, it can all be fixed :)
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They waltz around hand-in-hand.
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They waltz around hand-in-hand.
Both are equally capable of starting the dance; or leading once it's started.
It is possible to break out of the cycle. I've been fairly successful at it. But it took the assistance of something far greater than the cycle; far greater than self.
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It depends. If by quote-unquote "bad" behavior you mean self-destructive, self-injurious, or otherwise inwardly focused negative behavior, then, I'm sorry to say, a chicken/egg analogy is right on the money. Certainly self loathing can be a trigger for self destructive behavior; once that behavior becomes compulsive (as it quite often does) than the inability to stop engaging in it becomes the trigger for self loathing...which triggers the behavior witch triggers the self loathing which triggers the behavior, etc.This is an all too common cycle. The good news is, yes, it can be broken but it takes hard work with a good therapist.
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It depends. If by quote-unquote "bad" behavior you mean self-destructive, self-injurious, or otherwise inwardly focused negative behavior, then, I'm sorry to say, a chicken/egg analogy is right on the money. Certainly self loathing can be a trigger for self destructive behavior; once that behavior becomes compulsive (as it quite often does) than the inability to stop engaging in it becomes the trigger for self loathing...which triggers the behavior witch triggers the self loathing which triggers the behavior, etc.This is an all too common cycle. The good news is, yes, it can be broken but it takes hard work with a good therapist.
But the term "bad" is a little vague. As others have suggested, it might be helpful if you took away the quotes and nailed down a definition. Describing the actual behavior would be even better.
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I think those two could be correlated, but those aren't definitely connected. It doesn't have to be a cycle. I know some people with "self-hatred" who are perfectly nice creatures and vice versa. It's possible to break out of it but it takes motivation and the will to change.
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We don't spend nearly enough time thinking about facts, and far too much time constructing stories and rules for ourselves. It makes sense to think narratively, but often our stories and rules do not match the facts, and therefore our thoughts (and thus actions) become out of alignment with reality.
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We don't spend nearly enough time thinking about facts, and far too much time constructing stories and rules for ourselves. It makes sense to think narratively, but often our stories and rules do not match the facts, and therefore our thoughts (and thus actions) become out of alignment with reality.
An example of a story: My daughter says "My teacher is stupid." In so doing, she has created a story in which she is the victim, and her teacher is a villian. When she does so, not only has she disempowered herself but also provided herself with a ready excuse to treat her teacher and her schoolwork from that teacher with disregard. If she looked at the facts (with the presumption that her teacher was a reasonable, rational, compassionate human being) she would find that she does not enjoy aspects of the teacher's style, but the teacher does know more than she does about the subject being taught and therefore she should attend to that teacher's lectures regardless. A better story might be "My teacher gets on my nerves, but I need to do well in this class, so I try not to let it bother me."
An example of a rule: Fred tells me "A good day is when I make a big sale." Fred has boxed himself into having bad days most of the time. A better rule might be "A good day is any day above ground."
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